Hey Guys,

Is anyone using the IGEN as a proofing device for an offset press as well as using it for it's regular workflow?

Our printing company tried setting up a curve with Xerox and it was close to our press but we needed to tighten it up a little, a software upgrade came along and changed all our colours around and we haven't been able to meet our colour targets.

Is this something we should actualy be looking at doing? Curve or no curve, is the igen going to be able to maintain the colour consistency of a regular proofing device? Xerox has told us starting the print engine for a run of 1 all the time is not a good idea.

We run our Komori press at 150 linescreen - it gets great results. Our igen is usually calibrated for 175 and 200 linescreens, should we be setting up a 150 one for proofing as well?

Any help or input on this subject would be really appreciated.

Thanks

Chazman

Chazman,

From my experience I think you are going to run into problems trying to use your iGen as a proofing device for serveral reasons. As Xerox told you proofing one piece here and there isn't good for the iGen. It doesn't allow the machine to charge your developer and toner good enough resulting in poor image quality. The iGen also uses a different print order which means some files set up for the press will appear different printed on the iGen than if actually printed on a press. The iGen prints MYCK (KCYM from belt to paper) while a press normally prints KCMY. Another problem right now is that the iGen DFE (as well as other devices) are having trouble interpreting some design affects such as transparencies. Now don't forget that based on the machine usage your output will look different.

You are kind of comparing green apples to red apples when dealing with line screens. A press line screen is a lot tighter that the iGen's line screen. I lot of stuff that we print on the press is at 175 but that same job would probably be printed at 200 on the iGen.

I really doubt you are going to be able to get the consistent quality of a proofing device. If you ask my opinion.

Roosevelt

Wow, yikes this is a tough one.

In theory you can match your iGen3 to an offset press. But to use it for 1 off proofing is going to be very tough.

Unless things changed, Xerox used to recommend running 50-100 sheets before the press would reach color stability. Do that before judging the color and measuring the color for the match.

The gamut of the device is large enough for matching, however, color stability is a tough animal on an iGen3. It will drift and require relinearizaiton. In theory, relinearization should bring it back inline. If memory serves me, Xerox offers inline calibration to the DFE now on their DocuSP as a custom development. That could help a bit.

Certainly using the same line screen will make it better, but Xerox uses strange frequencies that don't match up to tranditional AM frequencies and dot rotation so your mileage my vary. There is no way, to my knowledge a way to over-ride those rotation angles and frequencies.

Bottom line is I highly doubt you will get the color consistency of a regular proofer or ink jet proofer on an iGen3 to do one off proofing to an offset press. You can get print runs to match offset within acceptable range (around 3-4 delta E) but using the iGen3 for proofing is dangerous.

Once you factor in all the time to calibrate and maintain the press, you could have bought an approval and it would have been cheaper. That proof is going to be very expensive when you factor in the 15-60 minutes its going to take per proof to achieve color, assuming no maintence would be needed.

I would recommend looking at inkjet for proofing, much cheaper and can match offset and much more pms colors.

Good luck.

I completely agree with Patrick.. Go Inkjet for color proofing you can get excellent results..

Dale

chazman,

I think the above posts are correct, but fail to mention the 1 type of proofing that might be necessary from time to time and could be time and cost effect on the igen. That is content proofing of pieces with large page counts like books. Many shops run a content proof of very large page count books on inkjets and spend the time and energy trimming everything out, backing everything up, etc. In those cases the igen might be a good time and cost saver.

cheers,
john

That is true, but the costs may be equal not necessarily cheaper.

With a good, cheap laser printer you can do the same thing and set a better expectation that the color isn't a match.

Also, you have to run a lot of pages for that 1 proof to justify the costs of the running (BHR), clicks, etc. You still are looking at 15-60 minutes for that proof.

Also, since it is cheaper to run a larger sheet, you would still need to cut the proof down, or pay even higher price for a 8.5x11 proof.

If it is a saddle stitch book, you need a bookletmaker or stitch it offline, which will add setup time and cost as well.

I still think a cheap collated laser and a good ink jet color proof beat an iGen3 any day as a proofing device when you look at total cost of proofing.